Tags:
One cannot but agree with point no. 1, except that it may apply to theosophists too.
Hinduism found Dharma in killing, even the near and dear ones, even those with whom one had no personal issues, through Lord Krsihna's teachings to Prince Arjuna. Yet Gautam Buddha preached Ahimsa. How to reconcile the two positions? When criticizing the Roman Catholic Church, the materialists or the scientists, whose side the theospohists are on - Krishna's or Buddha's?
More than any other thought system, the Theosophists claim to know of the Evolution and the Divine Plan. Do they believe that the current developments in the Genetic Engineering is outside this plan - not approved by the Sanatkumaras of the universe? Is that feasible?
History teaches us that Evolution comes at a price. Certain life-forms are eliminated and others are transformed. This is what Genetic Scientists are doing. If human beings have to exist outside of the limits of the physical bodies someday, then we have to pay the price today in the form of all the horrors that is described.
More than this understanding, I see the political principle of POWERSHIFT at work here. Most of us will happily accept "Miracles", in the form of of a person healing others with touch, materializing or moving objects out of thin air and all other countless starnge phenomena. We may even call these people Divine or Spiritualists. But what scientists are doing is to give this power to the people. And that is why there is so much of opposition to it. Biotechnology is a direct challenge to the concept of a GOD and its AGENTS. It is only natural that those who derive their "Power" from such concepts, oppose it. But can they stop it?
The only alternative for the Theosophists, if they do not change, is to perish. Are they up to it?
Please forgive if the words appear to be too harsh.Joe, Do you think "mythical superhuman masters" is a garbage idea? Or that many critics think that is so?
Even if the latter is the meaning, where do you think these "ideas, their value and their application" came from? From those Masters and Their greater Masters and so up the Golden Chain.
The notion of Masters need not be up front all the time or even much, but they cannot be tossed aside by theosophists because they are considered a "garbage idea" by anyone.
Joe Fulton said:
The nature of theosophies lends themselves to being timeless. Therefore the issue has to be one of expression.
The specific theosophy that most of us find common, that of the tradition identified with Blavatsky has become a caricature of the word theosophy, a mish mash of mythologies involving mythical superhuman masters, founders who need protection from enemies and detractors and all kinds of other garbage ideas clinging on to the kernel of divine wisdom.
What we have to get back to is the ideas, their value and their application. More importantly we have to make those our own, not someone elses. When we start doing this the wisdom will become one that we can share, not as a relic of the Victorian world, but as a guide into an uncertain future.
Captain Anand wrote: "Hinduism found Dharma in killing, even the near and dear ones, even those with whom one had no personal issues, through Lord Krsihna's teachings to Prince Arjuna."
This is the literal interpretation of the story, to which I do not adhere. I take the story as symbolical of the struggle between the spiritual side (Krishna - Higher Self) and the selfish elements - his own thoughts: family indeed- in Arjuna (the type of the human personality). The selfish elements have to be rooted out. One has to do one's duty and especially follow one's dharma or inner pattern. That's the symbolical meaning of the Bhagavad Gita. No contradiction with Gautama Buddha here!
I beg to differ with you on the other points too.
"But what scientists are doing is to give this power to the people"
Really? More often than not, power is given to multinationals who try to force-feed their products through the throats of the people through endless advertising, etc. I hope you do remember my remark on the selling of genetically modified seeds to the Indian farmers and the disastrous consequences of that?
Thanks Martin.
There are other meanings for the word Dharma too, in Indian Literature. It also means the principle which brings objects into motion and Adharma being the principle which brings objects into rest. The universe being the manifestation of motion, Dharma and Adharma symbolize the principles behind that manifestation and have nothing to do with good deeds, duty etc, as is popularly believed. The problem for ordinary people like us is to decide which of the meaning the author truly intended to convey, as all of them make sense.
Yet if one examines the principle of change, it includes annihilation of old and manifestation of new. Annihilation or elimination of old would be violence. Therefore violence should be an integral principle of evolution. Or, should one take the view that for a gene to change itself over thousand of years is OK but to do the same thing in laboratory in a short period of time is not?
Blaming the scientific community for the follies of Multinational Corporations is like blaming Einstein for the Fukushima Nuclear Power plant disaster. Humanity paid the price for the nuclear technology through Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Three Mile Island, Chernobyl and now Fuskushima. In between there would be many which are undocumented. But the same power is also lighting millions of homes in a far cleaner manner than any other means, today.
Indian farmers too paid the price and will pay in future too. But GM food is the answer to the hunger of the growing populations of the developing nations. Eventually market forces will sort out the most controversial of them all where the farmer has to purchase new seed before every crop. But, the increase in yield (up to three times), and reduced use of chemical fertilizers, insecticides or pesticides more than make up for that. Uncontrolled profiteering which the Multinationals are accused of, is our failure and not theirs. And, we have failed because we strayed from the basic Theosophical teaching of UNITY. As long as we consider them to be different from us, they shall succeed.
It is the scientists and their work which has allowed me to disagree with you, or communicate my views to you. If it was not for the internet, I could never hope to put my views across to a scholar of your stature. I would not have even heard about you or you about me. This is evolution. Let us welcome it. But be prepared to the price.
Ditto...
Don't we see the red flags in the drop in membership in most countries and even in the USA? In one of the largest US Cities, Atlanta, Georgia, the long time lodge has been downsized to a study center. A lodge requires a paltry seven members and a study center, just three.
What I see is the disconnect between those exposed to theosophy, whether they are formally attached to an organization or not, and the society in which they live. Let us get out of the cocoon and get involved in issues that matter to our fellow men and women and of course the First Object gives us the guiding principle to be used. Finally it is we, you and me, have to seize the opportunity and go forward.
Capt. Anand Kumar said:
The only alternative for the Theosophists, if they do not change, is to perish. Are they up to it?
One cannot but agree with point no. 1, except that it may apply to theosophists too.
Hinduism found Dharma in killing, even the near and dear ones, even those with whom one had no personal issues, through Lord Krsihna's teachings to Prince Arjuna. Yet Gautam Buddha preached Ahimsa. How to reconcile the two positions? When criticizing the Roman Catholic Church, the materialists or the scientists, whose side the theospohists are on - Krishna's or Buddha's?
More than any other thought system, the Theosophists claim to know of the Evolution and the Divine Plan. Do they believe that the current developments in the Genetic Engineering is outside this plan - not approved by the Sanatkumaras of the universe? Is that feasible?
History teaches us that Evolution comes at a price. Certain life-forms are eliminated and others are transformed. This is what Genetic Scientists are doing. If human beings have to exist outside of the limits of the physical bodies someday, then we have to pay the price today in the form of all the horrors that is described.
More than this understanding, I see the political principle of POWERSHIFT at work here. Most of us will happily accept "Miracles", in the form of of a person healing others with touch, materializing or moving objects out of thin air and all other countless starnge phenomena. We may even call these people Divine or Spiritualists. But what scientists are doing is to give this power to the people. And that is why there is so much of opposition to it. Biotechnology is a direct challenge to the concept of a GOD and its AGENTS. It is only natural that those who derive their "Power" from such concepts, oppose it. But can they stop it?
The only alternative for the Theosophists, if they do not change, is to perish. Are they up to it?
Please forgive if the words appear to be too harsh.
Thanks Capt. Anand. Yes, violence (or struggle) is an integral principle of evolution, provided that one does not forget to include the polar opposite: cooperation, mutualism as it is called in biology, etc. These form part of a dynamical process called life which includes evolution. As to genetic manipulation, there are multiple perspectives possible on that. On the one hand, a possible solution to hunger (although there is enough food in this world - only it is not properly distributed,a billion or so of the world population suffering from obesity, and perhaps another billion from undernourishment). But is it wise to allow GMO crops to crossbreed with plants in the wild, something which has already happened in the USA? One can't stop the wind blowing pollens across the country. What are the long-term consequences of this? No-one knows.
Nuclear energy is another story. The military have pushed the development of uranium-plutonium reactors, for obvious purposes - nuclear bombs - which is a questionable thing. Thorium based reactors are safer, as far as I know, and these are now under development.
"Joe: It is time to get out of this Victorian rabbit hole and join the rest of us in the 21st Century."
Then you had better pull all the Sanskrit, Buddhist, Jain, Theosophist, Path etc. content from this oh so contemporary site. Those rabbit holes are far deeper than the Victorian.
And since, (I suspect) that reverence is also a no-no here, better make sure reverence & adoration for the present forms of intellectual expression is muted. Otherwise the worship of Today will develop into a form of egoism just like my "worship" of the Ancient spiritual ideas.
© 2024 Created by Theosophy Network. Powered by