Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Andrew W. Smith on April 4, 2009 at 9:34pm

What never ceases to amaze me is how (and don't ask me for specifics, because I'm NO scientist) much Theosophy, as also Buddhism, are close to the "new physics" that we are discovering daily, hourly. Just as I love and admire the great Theosophists and Buddhists, I also greatly admire the scientists of today. Actually I admire almost all of the Great Thinkers of today who have contributed so much to our "learning curve." What wonders of the universe (multiverse? polyverse?) would we miss without all of them?!?

Permalink Reply by Andrew W. Smith on April 4, 2009 at 9:36pm

Sorry, I didn't mean just of "today" but of all time on earth, which to we who are Theosophists/Buddhists are all the "instants" (which is all we have) of time!

Permalink Reply by M. Sufilight on April 5, 2009 at 1:24pm

Dear Martin

I would like to know who you find to be the most brilliant thinkers since the last century?

Do you also find that it is worth considering, that since the HPB days - we so to speak - have had the theosophical Mahatmas and HPBs phenomenon replaced with Aliens, Ufos and cropcircles?

HPB talked about vimanas and also about millions of devas of various kinds.

In the Key to Theosophy 2. edition, we have in the Wordbook:
"Deva (Sans.) A god, a "resplendent" Deity, Deva-Deus, from the root div, "to shine." A Deva is a celestial being — whether good, bad or indifferent — which inhabits "the three worlds," or the three planes above us. There are 33 groups or millions of them. "


M. Sufilight

Permalink Reply by M. Sufilight on April 5, 2009 at 3:14pm

Dear Martin

My views are:

Thanks.
Interesting candidates. Are they all of them really theosophists?

May I ask how you define the term. "Brilliant thinkers"?
Are there any of those living claiming contact with the Masters?

I find, that What some view as being compassionate others might view as conclusions reached by the use of unexamined assumptions and lack of real true knowledge. The achievement of high emotions might by some beginner Seekers be considered as a spiritual activity.

What is non-compassionate aught to be told about, and the fact that it operates in that manner. And assumptions and prejudices are only what they are. Those doctrines followed, which effectviely prove themselves bad or even dangerous have to been abandoned - and shown to be so.

We need not only a heart of compassion. We also need to create harmony between: Head, Heart and Hands. - A Heart without a head is not helpful. A head without a hear is not helpful. The wise ones have developed their heads and hearts, and "hands" :-), so that they are not letting themselves getting hurt by small wishpers on the astral level.

I hold it to be important, that we concentrate on ourselves - as well as - on others. We aught as theosophists to work for the sake of humanity and not only ourselves. Yet, as Seekers, we always have to discard and unlearn bad activities and thought patterns, and even transcend thought while helping humanity as far as we are allowed. We can only do our best.

Why are there what you call "too much attention" on this issue of Ufos, aliens (devas) and cropcircles? Meny people on the planet are occupoed with the issue, and it make them consider why it is so difficult to reconcile with the Christian dogmas?

When various Seekers learn, they sometimes perceive the "revolver" you mentioned, when they in fact are being taught and encouraged to recognize truth when it is proven to them.

I am of the opinion, that all persons have a Conscience of a certain kind. So we get and give what the Law of Karma allows. Effort is what is required.

Just a few words and views from the chamber.

Permalink Reply by M. Sufilight on April 6, 2009 at 2:00pm

Thanks Martin

I will ponder your words.
And you could ponder on mine.

An "overthinker"?
Lol.


M. Sufilight

Permalink Reply by Martin Euser on April 8, 2009 at 6:13am

Hi Morton? Sufilight,

There seems to be a little confusion as to names here. There is the Martin from Amsterdam, Netherlands and Martin Euser (near Utrecht, Netherlands). As your question seems to be directed at me, I will reply as well. Some thinkers from the last century I discussed in my book, like Vitvan, Arthur Young, John Godolphin Bennett. There are many others, of course, but one can't study them all. The ones I mention have added considerably to my understanding of the wholeness of natural order process.

Permalink Reply by M. Sufilight on April 8, 2009 at 12:08pm

Dear Martin Euser

Thank you for your answer.
I just read parts of "Science and spirituality in the new millennium".
Somehow I find difficulties with the word "Holistic" - there is according to my view too much New-Age energy attached to it. And to me theosophical teachings operate on a higher level, that the ordinary use of the word. But that is just my view.



M. Sufilight

Permalink Reply by Andrew W. Smith on April 5, 2009 at 11:35am

Actually I, being the old geezer I am, like Theosophiy, Theosophical Society, Theosophical Lodges, etc., just fine! My only other alternative would be "The Theosophical Movement," but I believe that's already taken, too. LOL What on this earth, or any sentient planet, could be better than "Theosophy"? ("Wisdom-Religion" seems a little too sectarian for me.)

Permalink Reply by Martin Euser on April 13, 2009 at 5:25am

Joe Fulton said:
"The problem is that the whole Theosophical Movement has become so self-absorbed and incestuous that those who participate are pretty much true-believers."

Martin Euser: Indeed. Although, there are plenty of very nice people within the TSs, there is very little philosophical creativity as far as I can see. This is amazing, from the perspective of the second and third object, which explicitly state that comparative research must be done between science, religion, myth, etc., in order to develop a deeper insight into these matters. I suppose it boils partly down to natural laziness of people and the wish to belong to some group with which one can identify. A bit stranger is the fact that none of the successors of HPB has truly acknowledged the need for holistic scientific models. Even someone like De Purucker, who I esteem highly, has not done very much to help his students, among which were scientists, medical doctors, etc.; in this respect. I'm sure these students, fellow theosophers, would have wanted more clues as to how esoteric philosophy can be developed into a philosophy of science.
The study of analogy, process-theory, could have been given a more practical form long ago. Why o why have the leaders (and "the Masters" for that matter) not acknowledged this? Even the Brahmans have their fourfold model of nature/reality in a useful way (according to Subba Rao), why not the theosophers?

The other leaders probably didn't have a clue as to how to deal with this object. I'm simply diagnosing the historic situation. One almost begins to suspect that the whole of theosophy was only meant in the first place to give an impulse on the ethical level, a revival of ancient ideas about the place of humanity in the order of nature.
A moral philosophy, so to speak, much needed as religions had become fossils, lacking moral authority.


Joe said: "One of the prinicpal goals of this forum (The Theosophical Network) is to address this issue and attempt to focus this vast store of knowledge and energy outwards."

Martin Euser: what we really need is a group of people with a deep insight into philosophical and scientific matters that focuses on pioneering new ways of doing science, especially non-reductionist ways of process-philosophy. Personally I haven't seen anything like that in the TSs in the last hundred years.
My most likely estimate is that this will take place outside of the circle of TSs, more by relatively isolated individuals than by organized groups.

To summarize:

Joe said "We really need to address the issue of why, for the most part, the "outside" world does not take the Theosophical movement seriously."

Martin: Lack of creativity, for one thing. Plus, there is not a focused effort to do anything pioneering.



Joe said: "The reputation of the Theosophical movement is already that of a crazy cat lady. This must change. This movement must return to it's roots as one of inquiry and investigation. This alone will set us apart from the silliness of the "New Age". "

Martin: Yes, but this will likely take place outside of TSs. These lack creativity and the urge to investigate altogether, IMO.

Permalink Reply by Martin Euser on April 15, 2009 at 10:21am

Yes, Joe, true creativity comes about by a deep, spiritual, relation that a person has with the world.
On the one hand it is a personal thing, on the other hand it can be shared by those who hold the same values and interest. A philosophy of life, such as theosophy is, is, or should not be a static thing or affair; it should be a dynamic, evolving factor in the lives of many people who can relate to this philosophy. Inquiry and research is a natural thing, otherwise one is dead or asleep in the spiritual sense of the word. One can tune in to the current areas of interest, like "The Secret" to give one example, or genetic manipulation, or interfaith-dialogue, or whatever one feels attracted to.

Personally I have little affection anymore for any of the TSs. They seem to be vehicles of maintaining once useful ideas. People from these ranks can always come to this forum if they see and feel the necessity of change.

One thing will be necessary, in the future, that is to establish a certain focus for group work.
While individuals can do what they want to, groups should focus their energy into work that is guided by a clear vision of a goal to accomplish. A prerequisite for this is that individuals discover what it is that they want to contribute to the TS movement.

I haven't heard much from others yet, what they think about this forum..

Permalink Reply by M. Sufilight on April 13, 2009 at 6:38am

Dear friends and Martin Euser

My views are:

Martin, I saw your thoughts about a holistic science-philosophy model.

Maybe we all could learn something from the following Initiative.
Not that we need to do the exact same of course:

UnitedReligions Initiative (URI):
"UnitedReligions Initiative (URI) was founded in 2000 by an extraordinary global community committed to promoting enduring, daily interfaith cooperation and to ending religiously motivated violence. Today the URI includes thousands of members in over 65 countries representing more than 100 religions, spiritual expressions, and indigenous traditions.
URI is a global community with spiritual heart. Members from diverse backgrounds pioneer interfaith dialogue and peacebuilding skills. Its core organizational principles include inclusive membership, self-organizing initiatives and decentralized governance. Together, we are designing an effective communications and knowledge sharing network and exchanging best practices for local, regional and global organizing. We are deepening friendships and fostering solidarity. URI believes that people everywhere when inspired to cooperate for the common good, will find solutions to end religiously motivated hate and violence and will create initiatives that build cultures of peace, justice and healing. You are invited to participate in this unique global organization and imagine how to ignite the spirit of URI in your community.
Last Updated ( Monday, 02 March 2009 ) "
http://www.uri.org

- - -

H. P. Blavatsky said:
ENQUIRER. What was the object of this system?

THEOSOPHIST. First of all to inculcate certain great moral truths upon its disciples, and all those who were "lovers of the truth." Hence the motto adopted by the Theosophical Society: "There is no religion higher than truth." † The chief aim of the Founder of the Eclectic Theosophical School was one of the three objects of its modern successor, the Theosophical Society, namely, to reconcile all religions, sects and nations under a common system of ethics, based on eternal verities. "
.......
"The Theosophical Society was organized for the purpose of promulgating the Theosophical doctrines, and for the promotion of the Theosophic life. "
http://www.phx-ult-lodge.org/aKEY.htm




M. Sufilight

Permalink Reply by Martin Euser on April 13, 2009 at 8:16am

Sufilight:
Excellent initiative! People involved in URI will have acknowledged that people from other faith or religion are human too, and that they share certain values. This is a practical outcome of the idea of the necessity of interfaith dialogue, community building, peace projects, etc.

Your quote:

"The chief aim of the Founder of the Eclectic Theosophical School was one of the three objects of its modern successor, the Theosophical Society, namely, to reconcile all religions, sects and nations under a common system of ethics, based on eternal verities. "

points indeed to my "suspicion" that the TS was founded to give a moral impulse to a world which was degenerating into crass materialism (as a philosophy of life).
The more scientific-philosophical aims have been neglected sorely, I'd say. A modest begin of this has been made by me, the last couple of years. See my blog and book.
I do wonder who else is working on this matter in the TS movement. Anyone?
Martin Euser

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4
• 5
• Next ›
• Page