Theosophical Society membership - Theosophy.Net2024-03-29T15:57:09Zhttps://theosophy.net/forum/topics/theosophical-society-membership?commentId=3055387%3AComment%3A157540&feed=yes&xn_auth=noRichard - Thanks for sharing…tag:theosophy.net,2018-03-12:3055387:Comment:1575992018-03-12T18:04:57.319ZJohnhttps://theosophy.net/profile/JohnEMead
<p>Richard - Thanks for sharing the letter!</p>
<p>I think the capital "T" is a good approach.</p>
<p>Your tripartite work(s) seem interesting. You have taken on a difficult project. I wish you the best in this venture.</p>
<p>Ramadass should know how non-profits keep their tax-exempt status, and how to lose it. Of course, with Trump and Sessions in power, it is a hard call.</p>
<p>An aside: As I understand it, the 3 year limit for president, i.e.Tamil government law, is going to be appealed by…</p>
<p>Richard - Thanks for sharing the letter!</p>
<p>I think the capital "T" is a good approach.</p>
<p>Your tripartite work(s) seem interesting. You have taken on a difficult project. I wish you the best in this venture.</p>
<p>Ramadass should know how non-profits keep their tax-exempt status, and how to lose it. Of course, with Trump and Sessions in power, it is a hard call.</p>
<p>An aside: As I understand it, the 3 year limit for president, i.e.Tamil government law, is going to be appealed by TS/Adyar. We will post the court papers from India when, and if, that happens.</p>
<p>Peace -</p>
<p>John</p> Hi Dewald!
I've gotten confus…tag:theosophy.net,2018-03-02:3055387:Comment:1576782018-03-02T22:14:48.663ZJohnhttps://theosophy.net/profile/JohnEMead
<p>Hi Dewald!</p>
<p>I've gotten confused what we are arguing about. Where do you see us disagreeing? I think I agree with much of what you have said. I guess I will get Rorty's best selling book " <i>Philosophy and the Mirror of Nature</i>."</p>
<p>I was complaining about Sheldrake's 10 Myth's of Science. I said nothing about Morphic fields etc.It is his theory, and he has a right to have his theory.</p>
<p>In any case - I must have stated my position…</p>
<p>Hi Dewald!</p>
<p>I've gotten confused what we are arguing about. Where do you see us disagreeing? I think I agree with much of what you have said. I guess I will get Rorty's best selling book " <i>Philosophy and the Mirror of Nature</i>."</p>
<p>I was complaining about Sheldrake's 10 Myth's of Science. I said nothing about Morphic fields etc.It is his theory, and he has a right to have his theory.</p>
<p>In any case - I must have stated my position poorly.</p>
<p>Peace,</p>
<p>John</p>
<p></p>
<p>p.s. I do not have any knowledge of emended scripture by the Dalai Lama. The Dalai Lama also has said there is little difference between Buddhism and Christianity. Compassion and love are fundamental in both religions. It was an interesting statement.</p>
<p></p> Hi Dewald!
I was referring to…tag:theosophy.net,2018-03-01:3055387:Comment:1577132018-03-01T17:59:58.388ZJohnhttps://theosophy.net/profile/JohnEMead
<p>Hi Dewald!</p>
<p>I was referring to Sheldrake and how his 10 "Myths of Science" are fictional. They belong in the Flat Earth Society <g>.</p>
<p>Scientists usually do not blindly accept anything. They search to find where science fails so they can get the next Nobel Prize. Many also change their opinion(s) as needed. This includes Interpretation of QM or other theories. I will agree that some Scientists get stuck in a rut of what they think and believe.</p>
<p>I think people (esp.…</p>
<p>Hi Dewald!</p>
<p>I was referring to Sheldrake and how his 10 "Myths of Science" are fictional. They belong in the Flat Earth Society <g>.</p>
<p>Scientists usually do not blindly accept anything. They search to find where science fails so they can get the next Nobel Prize. Many also change their opinion(s) as needed. This includes Interpretation of QM or other theories. I will agree that some Scientists get stuck in a rut of what they think and believe.</p>
<p>I think people (esp. Theosophists) tend to dismiss Science too easily. However, the Dalai Lama pointed out that if Science disagrees with Doctrine, then you have to reexamine your scriptures. That seems to be a valid approach.</p>
<p>oh well. People do get to choose their opinions. That is healthy.</p>
<p>Peace -</p>
<p>john</p> Thanks! <G>
tag:theosophy.net,2018-03-01:3055387:Comment:1575792018-03-01T16:21:48.332ZJohnhttps://theosophy.net/profile/JohnEMead
<p>Thanks! <G></p>
<p></p>
<p>Thanks! <G></p>
<p></p> er, i thought my last sentenc…tag:theosophy.net,2018-02-26:3055387:Comment:1575772018-02-26T10:52:51.912ZDewald Besterhttps://theosophy.net/profile/DewaldBester
<p>er, i thought my last sentence was ambigious.</p>
<p>i dont meant tapping out of the conversation with me, which would not likely result in death - more like relief i imagine.</p>
<p>i mean, giving into science too completely will result in the death of many world views.</p>
<p></p>
<p>dewald</p>
<p>er, i thought my last sentence was ambigious.</p>
<p>i dont meant tapping out of the conversation with me, which would not likely result in death - more like relief i imagine.</p>
<p>i mean, giving into science too completely will result in the death of many world views.</p>
<p></p>
<p>dewald</p> The Dalai prevaricates. Which…tag:theosophy.net,2018-02-26:3055387:Comment:1575752018-02-26T07:38:55.724ZDewald Besterhttps://theosophy.net/profile/DewaldBester
<p>The Dalai prevaricates. Which of his tantric commitments has he given up in the face of the scientific onslaught.?</p>
<p>I think you are unimpressed by Kuhn (paradigms), Rorty (the world is always under description, and has no preferred way of being described) etc. which is ok.</p>
<p>But, that is a choice.</p>
<p>From medicine to physics, one can find academic publications which challenge the 'science got it right' narrative. Philosophically, it is even easier, nietzsche, foucault,…</p>
<p>The Dalai prevaricates. Which of his tantric commitments has he given up in the face of the scientific onslaught.?</p>
<p>I think you are unimpressed by Kuhn (paradigms), Rorty (the world is always under description, and has no preferred way of being described) etc. which is ok.</p>
<p>But, that is a choice.</p>
<p>From medicine to physics, one can find academic publications which challenge the 'science got it right' narrative. Philosophically, it is even easier, nietzsche, foucault, heidegger, and, can i say, Rorty again. I love that guy.</p>
<p>Theosophists interested in science, I think, will 'use' science when it is helpful. And ignore when it is not.Sometimes they will challenge it, and point to peripheral scientists, e.g. David Pratt. The theosophy/science interaction is a little more complicated than i think you imply, and in HPB's time, I would suggest, she was justified in her opinions. Today, more work needs to be done.</p>
<p>I think Rorty gives an acceptable argument that rational argument does not result in changes of mind. Rationality is not a question of 'content' of specific beliefs, but of overall coherence of a position.</p>
<p>Have you ever read Daston and Galison study of 'objectivity' in the sciences? Scientists are as prone to blindness as anyone else.</p>
<p>The point is not to dump science by to re-describe what it is doing. What it is not doing is describing the world as it really is in itself. Neither, of course is Theosophy, theosophy, or any other religion. That is the bargain struck.</p>
<p>I would like to see a space for theosophy, religion, etc in the world. Not as a favour, but as as warranted and justified position for normal rational people to take in the world.</p>
<p></p>
<p>don't tap out too soon. the result of tapping is death.</p>
<p></p>
<p>rgds</p>
<p></p>
<p>Dewald</p>
<p></p> Sorry to hear about the exper…tag:theosophy.net,2018-01-22:3055387:Comment:1572332018-01-22T13:14:22.889ZM K Ramadosshttps://theosophy.net/profile/MKR
<p>Sorry to hear about the experience.</p>
<p>Many are praying for a turn around and hopefully some thing will happen.</p>
<p>In pre-Internet days, what happened in one lodge is kept secret from rest of the members.</p>
<p>Today with Internet, transparency is there.</p>
<p>Let us hope the transparency helps to see better days.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Regards</p>
<p></p>
<p>Ramadoss</p>
<p>Sorry to hear about the experience.</p>
<p>Many are praying for a turn around and hopefully some thing will happen.</p>
<p>In pre-Internet days, what happened in one lodge is kept secret from rest of the members.</p>
<p>Today with Internet, transparency is there.</p>
<p>Let us hope the transparency helps to see better days.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Regards</p>
<p></p>
<p>Ramadoss</p> hi
If anyone reading this pos…tag:theosophy.net,2018-01-22:3055387:Comment:1576632018-01-22T07:17:03.859ZDewald Besterhttps://theosophy.net/profile/DewaldBester
<p>hi</p>
<p>If anyone reading this post wants to know how a TS lodge (Cape Town) dies, you can email me privately - besterdewald@gmail.com.</p>
<p>For the sake of TS family honour, I'd prefer not to air dirty laundry in public. There is hopefully an attempt at a turnaround. But this story should shock even the stupidest and most navel gazing of TS management.</p>
<p>of course, I can only tell my tale, others can tell theirs. I can accept there are other versions.</p>
<p>--</p>
<p>On…</p>
<p>hi</p>
<p>If anyone reading this post wants to know how a TS lodge (Cape Town) dies, you can email me privately - besterdewald@gmail.com.</p>
<p>For the sake of TS family honour, I'd prefer not to air dirty laundry in public. There is hopefully an attempt at a turnaround. But this story should shock even the stupidest and most navel gazing of TS management.</p>
<p>of course, I can only tell my tale, others can tell theirs. I can accept there are other versions.</p>
<p>--</p>
<p>On science:</p>
<p>There are other orientations to modern science than simple acceptance. A tradition based on Kuhn, Feyeraband, and my favourite philosopher, Richard Rorty. The point, here, is that there is more than one mainstream, academic way, to respond to the scientific endeavour.</p>
<p>Rgds</p>
<p>Dewald</p> The membership is daily shrin…tag:theosophy.net,2018-01-22:3055387:Comment:1574002018-01-22T06:25:01.955ZM K Ramadosshttps://theosophy.net/profile/MKR
<p>The membership is daily shrinking with closing of branches and study centers. This is the trend world-wide.</p>
<p>Lack of credible leadership is obvious. World witnessed last election of International President which is now litigated in courts in India. An international organization with a part-time visiting leaders cannot grow. It also looks like money has complicated the mission of Theosophical Society. When in early days, money was short, spreading theosophy was the focus. Now all…</p>
<p>The membership is daily shrinking with closing of branches and study centers. This is the trend world-wide.</p>
<p>Lack of credible leadership is obvious. World witnessed last election of International President which is now litigated in courts in India. An international organization with a part-time visiting leaders cannot grow. It also looks like money has complicated the mission of Theosophical Society. When in early days, money was short, spreading theosophy was the focus. Now all sections around the world is flush with money and is not attracting right kind of leaders who are passionate and are willing to sacrifice for a cause.</p>
<p>Added to the above is the secret mass cancellation of dedicated life members is unprecedented. Current leaders were surprised when the victims went to the courts seeking justice. The issue is now in the courts and Theosophical Society is defending itself with an army of lawyers who are only too happy to litigate. The negative PR out of fighting in the courts is also having a long term effect. For example, the recent International Convention at Adyar was not covered by the local media even though the Governor of Tamil Nadu addressed it.</p>
<p></p>
<p>John is right. Operations are always hidden. So far it has succeeded and today the big factor that is in play is Internet which brings transparency. And the leaders are not using Twitter or Facebook to encourage and spread theosophy ideas. When Trump and Indian Prime Minister Modi are effectively using Twitter to keep in touch with their 30 million followers, theosophy leaders are missing in Twitter.</p>
<p>The future seems to be in the hands of you and me and we can be creative and use Twitter and Facebook to advance our ideas and encourage others. Soon we can expect a creative young man or woman to come up with a great idea how to present theosophy.</p>
<p>My 0.02. Any comments are welcome!</p> Hi Dewald!
Thanks for the cla…tag:theosophy.net,2018-01-21:3055387:Comment:1572322018-01-21T20:03:55.011ZJohnhttps://theosophy.net/profile/JohnEMead
<p>Hi Dewald!</p>
<p>Thanks for the clarifications, I really appreciate that.</p>
<p></p>
<p>My experiences are based mostly from on-line interactions (now). Any criticism of HPB is often met with very strong posts (attacks). It is often a zealous belief in the infallibility of HPB and the Masters. It feels like talking to fundamentalists. I am glad your experiences have been different.</p>
<p></p>
<p>In the US, the ES actually appears to run everything. It is difficult to really say, since…</p>
<p>Hi Dewald!</p>
<p>Thanks for the clarifications, I really appreciate that.</p>
<p></p>
<p>My experiences are based mostly from on-line interactions (now). Any criticism of HPB is often met with very strong posts (attacks). It is often a zealous belief in the infallibility of HPB and the Masters. It feels like talking to fundamentalists. I am glad your experiences have been different.</p>
<p></p>
<p>In the US, the ES actually appears to run everything. It is difficult to really say, since everything is rather cloaked in secrecy. The top officers are mostly ES members. Also, as I understand it, to form a study group now requires the study of HPB first. I am not sure that is a good approach.</p>
<p><br/>As to rejection of Science - one example is that many theosophists actually believe in Sheldrake's list of 10 Scientific Dogmas. Sheldrake is just wrong. His view of science is really taken from the18th and early-mid 19th century physics, which was all deterministic. That view really changed in the late 19th century and early 20th century. That is mostly post-HPB science. Obviously other issues come up as well.</p>
<p><br/>I mostly agree with your observation:</p>
<p>"the two chief material failings of the TS, in my estimation, are: lack of focus, and lack of organizational structure. That there may be other karmic reasons is beyond my ken."</p>
<p><br/>We would probably disagree as to what the focus should be. The TSA (TS in America/Wheaton IL) is organized, but things are always hidden. </p>
<p></p>
<p>In any case, I think my tirade is nearly done. <g> I really appreciate the feedback and will take it to heart. Perhaps I will begin to post Science topics/insights again.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Peace - John</p>
<p></p>